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DISTINCTLY FULLPRET
POSITIONS IN THIS ARTICLE:
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SOME DISTINCTIVE DOCTRINES OF SYSTEMATIZED
HYPER PRETERISM
It is important to keep in mind that many ideas and doctrines
full preterism appeals to - such as the complete end of the Old
Covenant world in AD70 - are by no means distinctive to that view.
Many non HyPs believe this as well, so one need not embrace the Hyper
Preterist system in order to endorse this view. Following
are exceptional doctrines which, so far as I've seen, are only taught by
adherents of Hyper Preterism.:
DISTINCTIVE DOCTRINES TAUGHT BY STANDARD
FULL PRETERISM
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All Bible Prophecy was Fulfilled By AD70
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Atonement Incomplete at Cross ;
Complete at AD70
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The Supernatural Power of Evil
Ended in AD70
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The Spirit of Antichrist was
Destroyed in AD70
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"The Consummation of the Ages"
Came in AD70
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"The Millennium" is in the Past, From
AD30 to AD70
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Nothing to be Resurrected From
in Post AD70 World ; Hades Destroyed
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The Christian Age Began in AD70
; Earth Will Never End
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"The Day of the Lord" was Israel's
Destruction ending in AD70
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The "Second Coming" of Jesus
Christ Took Place in AD70-ish
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The Great Judgment took place
in AD70 ; No Future Judgment
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The Law, Death, Sin, Devil,
Hades, etc. Utterly Defeated in AD70
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"The Resurrection"
of the Dead and Living is Past, Having Taken
Place in AD70
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The Context of the Entire Bible
is Pre-AD70 ; Not Written To Post AD70 World
DISTINCTIVE DOCTRINES TAUGHT BY VARIOUS FORMS
(under construction)
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Baptism was for Pre-AD70 Era (Cessationism)
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The Lord's Prayer was for Pre-AD70
Era (Cessationism)
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The Lord's Supper was for Pre-AD70
Era (Cessationism)
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The Holy Spirit's Paraclete Work
Ceased in AD70 (Cessationism)
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The Consummation in AD70 Caused
Church Offices to Cease (Cessationism)
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The Resurrection in AD70 Changed
the "Constitutional Principle" of Marriage (Noyesism)
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Israel and Humanity Delivered into
Ultimate Liberty in AD70 (TransmillennialismTM)
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The Judgment in AD70 Reconciled All
of Mankind to God ; All Saved (Preterist Universalism)
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Adam's Sin No Longer Imputed in
Post AD70 World ; No Need to be Born Again (Preterist Universalism)
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When Jesus Delivered the Kingdom to
the Father in AD70, He Ceased Being The Intermediary (Pantelism/Comprehensive
Grace?)
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The Book of Genesis is an
Apocalypse; is About Creation of First Covenant Man, not First Historical
Man (Covenantal Preterism)
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A Look at Who Babylon is in the
Book of Revelation
By Michael Krall
There are probably as man interpretations as to who Babylon is as
there are as to who the Antichrist is. We will not give a lengthy
dissertation as to who we believe she is but we will let Scripture speak
for itself and let the reader carefully examine the verses and see for
themselves.
Many think that either Roman Catholicism or the world system is
Babylon. They seem to be the most common of views today. The Reformers
and the Puritans were big on applying it to the Roman Catholic Church
but does the Word of God support that.
Here are a few verses of Scripture to look at and then ask yourself
who she is.
Revelation 18
20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and
ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged
you on her.
Who persecuted the Apostles? Since that was a first century office
can it be the Roman Catholic Church? Were they around to persecute the
apostles? This is something vastly overlooked by many when the try to
decipher who this city is. One need only to look closely at these verses
and they will easily be able to rule out many possible candidates. From
this verse we can see that it has to be a city that was around at the
time of the apostles and actually persecuted them that is why they are
avenged by her demise.
Here is our next verse:
And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and
the voice of the bridegroom and of the
bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy
merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were
all nations deceived.
Was the voice of the bride and the bridegroom ever come forth from
the Roman Catholic Church or the world system? What is the voice of the
bride and the bridegroom? If Christ is the groom then his church must be
the bride. There are a number of things the voice of the bride can be.
The voice of both the Bride and the Bridegroom could be the very gospel
of our Lord. Is that not what they proclaiming to sinners? Is that not
the voice of her? Or maybe her voice is one in prayer to the Lord
himself. The voice of the bride is sometimes cries or intercession and
adoration to the Bridegroom. Some times the voice of the Bride and the
Groom are such things as we find in the Song of Solomon. In any case
these are not things that are heard in the Roman Catholic Church nor the
world system. They have neither the gospel nor the prayers of adoration
and praise to our Redeemer. So both are ruled out by this verse. But
lets now look at the following verse in chapter 18 of Revelation and
compare it to a passage in Matthew 23.
24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of
all that
were slain upon the earth.
Matt 23
35 That upon you may come all the righteous
blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel
unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the
temple and the altar.
Now comparing these to scriptures from Matt 23 and Rev 18 who does
it look like Babylon is? The similarity of these two passages are more
than mere coincidence. We will let the reader prayerfully see for him or
herself.
In our next 2 set of verses we need to back up a chapter in
Matthew to chapter 22. In this chapter Jesus is telling a parable of the
kingdom of heaven being like a king which made a marriage feast for his
son. None come for all have excuses as to why they cannot come to the
feast. We must keep in mind that this is a parable about the kingdom of
heaven. What does the say and do after those who were bidden to the
wedding refuse? Inverse 7 we read: But when the king heard thereof,
he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those
murderers, and burned up
their city.
8 Then saith he to his
servants, The
wedding is ready, but they which
were bidden were not worthy. After the city was burned in Matt 22
parable comes the wedding feast. What was that city in Matt 22? The
answer is quite clear but we will let the reader see for him or herself
as we read on. Look at the verse that follows the parable of the
marriage feast: 15 ¶
Then went the Pharisees, and took counsel how they might entangle him in
his talk.
The very fact of the reaction of the Pharisees give support as to
whom Jesus was referring to.
But note the comparison of that to Rev 18-19.
Rev 18:17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And
every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many
as trade by sea, stood afar off,
18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her
burning, saying, What city is like unto this great
city!
Rev 19:7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him:
for the marriage of the Lamb is come,
and his wife hath made herself ready.
Note that in both these sections of Scripture the city is burned and
then comes the marriage feast. Is there any doubt now as to the reality
of whom the great city is? The comparison of Matthew 22 with Revelation
18-19 is very striking.
No study of Babylon’s identification is complete without looking at
chapter 11 in Revelation.
Re 11:8 And their dead bodies
shall lie in the street of the
great city, which spiritually
is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord
was crucified.
The city where our Lord was crucified speaks for itself as to who
that is. But the term “great city” also sheds some light on it. A
passage in the Old Testament book of Jeremiah helps us here.
Jer 22:8 And many nations shall pass by this city, and they shall
say every man to his neighbor, Wherefore hath the LORD done thus unto this great city? 9
Then they shall answer, Because they have forsaken the covenant of the LORD their God, and
worshipped other gods, and served them.
Who is he talking about in Jeremiah?
Now in the light of these passages of Scripture what is the more
likely candidate for Babylon that Great City? We will let the reader
answer in the theater of his or her own conscience.
What do YOU think ?
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Date: 07 Jan 2006
Time: 23:22:42
Comments:
In the first century the tiny nation of Israel was a wretched, crushed,
humiliated, despairing and defeated nation, just one of the many nations
that had been invaded, conquered and occupied by Rome, the great
first-century superpower, "that great city that reigned over the kings of
the earth" (Rev. 17:18) If preterists believe that Jerusalem, rather than
Rome, was the great first-century superpower then they probably also believe
that today the tiny, wretched, crushed, humiliated, despairing, defeated,
invaded, conquered and occupied nation of Iraq, rather than the USA, is the
great 21st-century superpower.
Date: 10 Jan 2006
Time: 12:19:00
Comments:
OT, natural Israel had to contend with the natural bondage in which it was
held in natural Egypt AND with the natural captivity in which it was held in
natural Babylon. Therefore, given the unalterable principle of first the
natural and then the spiritual (1 Cor. 15:46), in the first century NT,
spiritual Israel had to contend with the spiritual bondage in which it was
held by spiritual Egypt, i. e., Jerusalem (Rev. 11:8), AND with the
spiritual captivity in which it was held by spiritual Babylon, i. e., Rome.
AD 70 preterists' erroneous belief that Jerusalem was the only
first-century, earthly enemy of God's people means that they believe that
anti-Christian religions and cults are the only enemy of the church and that
an anti-Christian state is not an enemy of the church. Anti-Christian
governments everywhere undoubtedly are very appreciative of that support for
their policies and actions.
Date: 04 Feb 2006
Time: 17:39:17
Comments:
In answer to the first comment:
Jerusalem was very wealthy in the days before her distruction. Read
Josephus, Wars 5:5ff. This is a description of the Temple of that Great
City.
Real history is more accurate than the movies.
cml
Date: 11 Feb 2006
Time: 17:08:37
Comments:
Hi All
In spite of the other overly emotional comments in
reaction to this pretty clear Biblical argument, the fact remains that
Jerusalem was the enemy of the Jewish Christians, especially in the wake
of the persecution in 62 CE that claimed James, Jesus' brother, and
doubtless many others. Prior there was the persecution in 42 CE backed
by the (temporary) Jewish king, which killed James, brother of John, and
imprisoned Peter, and before that the persecution that began with
Stephen's martyrdom in 36 CE.
Everytime the Jewish authorities
had a chance - i.e. were loosed from Roman restraint - they persecuted
the Christians in Jerusalem. Rivalries were 'hot' even where Jews
weren't in power - the fight within the synagogues became so violent all
Jews, Christian and other, were expelled from Rome by Claudius in 50 CE.
And the enmity lasted into the War led by Bar Kockba in 132-135, when
Jewish Christians were killed for not joining the war against Rome.
So tell me who actively went out of their way to persecute and kill
Christians? We know Nero did eventually, but the first 30 years of
opposition was from within Jerusalem itself. And what did the rabbis who
opposed their Messianic kin eventually call Jesus? A legally-condemned
blasphemous sorcerer, thus setting the stage for another 1900 years of
hatred between the two.
What's vital is for non-Jewish Christians
to realise that all the anti-Jewish bile in the NT was 'fulfilled'
sufficiently by the appalling destruction of 70 CE. That the Jews didn't
learn the lesson and tried again in 132-135 CE was the 'cup of their
arrogance running over'. There is no more prophecy to justify any
anti-Semitism in this world - a message people like Tim LaHaye needs to
wake up to.
Date: 13 Mar 2006
Time: 19:40:23
Comments:
Jerusalem is the city, if you believe that Jesus has come again. If you are
still waiting and watching then any city, present and/or in the future,could
be the city.
Date: 08 May 2006
Time: 17:34:16
Comments:
The great city Babylon is fallen,is fallen. The great city, the harlot, was
old Jerusalem. God told the fleshly Jews of all the tribes of Israel,
through the Old testament and New Testament, if you don't repent of your
wicked ways, I WILL destroyed this place and all that destroyed the earth
and burn the city with fire.
After the gospel of Christ went out into all the old world (ends of the
earth) to all Jews and Gentiles and all was saved by water baptism, The Lord
Jesus Christ appeared in the clouds (70 A.D.) all the eyes did see hem, even
those that pieced him, and there was much wailing in the earth, The warth of
the Lamb came upon all them that would not repent and be baptized with
water. GOD open the heavens and earth and the great flood evil came upon
them. GOD sent the army's of the Chaldeens upon them and destroyed them that
destroyeth the earth and burnt there city with fire and no man rise up that
city again.
The only people left BEHIND was Christians. All the GOATS perish. WE the
Christians where rised up from the dead and set in heavenl places with
Christ, we labor to be where is today and forever. WE over came that old
wicked world, the mark of the breast in our hands and mind, and his number
666, mark of a man by faith in Christ Jesus. The JUST live by faith.
WE are of the new heaven and earth without a sea. All saved by GRACE, a gift
of God in Christ Jesus. WE wear not Mark of a man, but the MARk of an angle
144 (we are perfect in Christ with God the Father).
ALL we see today, in all nation, is disobeyienced to God's everlasting
coverant in the eternal life with Christ.
Andrewj144pa@cs.com
Date: 18 Aug 2006
Time: 10:41:09
Comments:
I believe Babylon was referring to Jerusalem in 70 AD. I'm also a preterest.
I'm having difficulty, however, trying to discern if Babylon, the mother of
all harlotts, Mystery the Great, and the woman are all the same referring to
Jerusalem. This has been on my mind for some time now. Some like to use
Roman Catholic Church as the woman which "Astonished" St. John. However, I
still believe the woman, which became the Harlott, was Jerusalem.
My next concern is the 1000 years reign. I'm under the impression that this
began when Constatine permitted peace with the Church, and the first three
centuries of mass torture and martyer came to a hault. Christianity
flourishes for the next 1000 years until Islam rose, Satan was released, and
the Spanish Inquisition indicated a corrupt church. Stories like Joan of Ark
(If true) seem to indicate that Christ was working and indeed ruling the
Nations with an Iron Sceptor. He punished Nations which perverted
Christianity. I'm mostly preterist, but I have difficulty with the 1000 year
reign being secluded to simply 70 AD.
Date: 26 Aug 2006
Time: 11:24:15
Comments:
I truly believe, if we deny that Christ did not come the second time for
salvation, then we are not raised from the dead (for all was dead in sin).
At that time we all stand before the great white throne of God and our Lord
Jesus Christ and was judged for our works, good and bad. All confessed that
Jesus Christ is Lord. We that where saved (Sheep-jews and Gentiles) was
raised up and set on the throne of glory with Christ, we judged the twelve
tribes of Israel (fleshly, his enemy)with Christ. And we became like him (in
his Spirit). Those that where not saved at that time (Goats) perish. They
where cast into the lake of fire, which is the second death. They had no
part of his glory. They are in torment even unto this day before Christ and
his angels.
Then Lord God Almighty sent his warth of the Lamb upon them that destroyeth
the earth and burnt there city (fleshly Jerusalem, 70 A.D.)with fire. No man
will was it up again. The only ones left was christians. When they come into
that city, they found 350,000 dead and it took them 6 months to bury them.
I truly believe we our in the new heaven and earth with no more sea. We are
under his New Ccvenant in the precious blood of Christ. We have eternal
life. There is no more sorrow, pain, and death for us.
I know today I was raised in a false doctrine and the Lord brought back to
him.
The 1000 year rein was before Christ came. Remember a 1000 years can be one
day and 1 day can be a 1000 years with God. Those 1000 years was 35-70 A.D..
Lord God Almighty was doing everything he said he would so all would saved.
When appearred in his glory (70A.D.) all the eyes did see him even those
that living that pieced him.
I am not trying to get people saved, for I know that all where saved that
came out of that old world of sin. WE of this new world are not sinner, for
there is no more law of works. It was taken out way, nailed to his cross.
I have to stop, for I get so over joyed.
Date: 22 Feb 2007
Time: 09:17:51
Comments:
Well Looking At At New York 9:11 Is A place Where The Merchants Set
A-far Off And Watched Her Burn She Was Paid Back Double Because Both
Towers Were Destroed And Burnt To The Ground All in one Hr.I think This
Could Be Bablon. It sure Fits The The Picture.
Date: 04 Nov 2007
Time: 00:57:29
Comments:
I think we ALL need to get into God's Word more consistently and then we
will gain wisdom and understanding of the things we think we know.
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